Sometimes I fall in to passive mode and don't know why...

[Da_Big_Fish]

Sometimes I feel like I fall in to being passive. I checked this hand with the ITH pre flop chart and it recommends a call, but I figure with 4 years of playing behind me if the flop doesn't work out I'd have the sense to get away from it. Would it be correct to reraise the flop here? And if I do that, am I locked into a CB on the turn since I showed so much strength on the flop?

0.1/0.2 Limit Holdem
9 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Pre-flop: (1.5 SB, 9 players) Hero is BB
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, 5 folds, SB calls, Hero checks

Flop: (4.0 SB, 4 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG raises, UTG+1 calls, SB folds, Hero calls

Turn: (5.0 BB, 3 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets, UTG+1 calls, Hero calls

River: (8.0 BB, 3 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 checks

[Piemaster]

I think that in the absense of reads, your only possible mistake here was not raising preflop for value (which is marginal). Passive play is not 'bad' per se. In fact, it is often the best line, depending on the situation and your opponents.

[Cript]

[the_hawk]

Given everyone's relative positions I think 3-betting the flop might simply be bloating the pot where we're not quite sure where we stand (although I agree there's a good chance we're in good shape here).

If the positions were different and we had a chance to make the likely flush draw holder call two cold then things might be different - but they've already cold-called here and a 3-bet isn't going to drive them out.

It's certainly true that passive isn't automatically bad.

[Cript]

[Piemaster]

I also quite like the plan of donking the two of stars on the turn.

[Schlepper333]

Pre-flop SSHE recommends a call here, too. But I think it is borderline and dependent on how many limpers/how table is playing. SSHE raises if it were suited, though.

[shallam]

While you have a strong hand, it is just a pair and when someone raises you have to at least consider the possibility that you are beat. You could be up against AA, KK, AK, KT, TT, 33 and at these limits even T3s. And while I think I would have 3 bet the flop, just calling here is a close second. If you three bet and your opp caps you'll be pretty unhappy.

I slightly lean toward raising due to the presence of the second opp, charging him an extra bet gives you extra reward for those times you win. At these stakes many players with call with almost any two cards which might include a gutshot or a pocket pair. If your opp caps or raises the turn, I'd then go into passive check-call mode.

You say you don't know why you went to passive mode. My guess is that you did it because you got raised. A concept worth keeping in mind when you are on a draw and could use a free turn card.

BTW, I don't think that going into passive mode is terrible. Entirely understandable IMHO.

[shallam]

After reading the comments of others I aggree that a very strong alternative is calling the flop and betting the turn (although I'd be aware that the 9 card fills in an OES draw). The downside of the call flop/lead turn play that you charge the second opp less for his his draw (raising the flop charges him 3 or 4 calling only 2).

[anthonya530]

[shallam]

[jeffnc]

Preflop I think the check is fine - in some games you are likely enough to have people dominated so raising would be better, but you are also putting more money in the pot with bad position. Probably doesn't matter a whole lot since you'll just be betting right out for value if you hit the flop.

I would reraise the flop. It's obviously unlikely he has AK, but may very well have KJ or K9. KT is very possible but most players who would limp under the gun with KT are the type of players who are more likely to slowplay that a little more. Of course it should not be slowplayed and I myself might limp with that hand in some games and then pound the heck out of on the flop too.

Exact same can be said for TT except that it's slightly more likely to be slowplayed (but still shouldn't be).

If the player were particularly aggressive I'd think there were a good chance he had a good draw here, or just had KJ, so don't mind leading the turn again. Of course you're never "committed" to doing anything because you showed aggression. I'd do it simply for value and/or not giving a free card.

As for getting tricky to avoid "bloating the pot" and giving correct odds to draw on the turn, I'm not sure about that. Even if you just call they are getting correct odds for flushes and open ended straights, so you might as well put in more money when you're ahead. Even if you raise you won't be giving correct odds for gutshots. That leaves hands that have made one pair to the T or 3, like AT, T9, A3 etc. You are just about giving them the right price to call on the turn by raising.

Personally, I'm a little more interested with getting more value when I'm ahead than trying to make someone else make a mistake.

[jeffnc]

[jeffnc]