Razz

[cowboyfan]

I've started messing around with very low limit Razz a bit lately and done very well (beginner's luck to be sure). Is this a game where there's a lot of value in reading some books on it, or are you better off formulating your own strategy?

If I should buy a book or two, what would you recommend?


Thanks.

[nsidestrate]

Sklansky has a book called "Sklansky on Poker" that includes a pretty good Razz section (about half the book). The lowball section of supersystem is also useful.

Ashley Adams has written a few web articles that are a good overview as well.

[toronexti]

Don't play razz you'll hate yourself at the end.

[nsidestrate]

I actually kind of like Razz.

[toronexti]

I had to stop my occasional playing of it after I started with something like A23 got a 6 on 4th and ended up with a boat.

[jmbreslin]

I've been playing around a bit lately too, mainly because I've become really interested in mixed games (HORSE and 8-Game).

So far I've played 4 Razz sessions and have yet to book a winning session. It's an incredibly frustrating game. I can't tell you how many times I've started with amazing cards and then had to fold when low cards went to my opponents and I got stuck with high cards and/or pairs.

It's actually a very simple game to learn so you don't really need to read much about strategy. Here's what I've learned from the bit I've read and from discussing the game with people on another forum:

1) It requires more patience and discipline than any other poker game

2) Focus on playing only starting hands with 3 cards lower than 8

3) Pay close attention to the live and dead cards

4) The bets double on 5th street, so don't draw past 4th with marginal hands

5) Here's a great piece of advice for learning the game: give your opponent credit for the nuts based on what he's showing. If your hand is better, then drive the betting; if your hand is worse, check-fold.

6) Low stakes players don't have the patience and discipline that's required, which means you can make money with made hands but you'll also get drawn out on a lot. Thus, low stakes Razz can be a very high-variance game.

[clabbers]

Pretty good tips. I'll add a couple more.

Don't bother with 87x as an opener unless it fits another category below.

Mandatory Steal: The bring-in has been folded around to you as last to act, bring-in has paint showing you have 9 or less showing. Less mandatory, but usually worthwhile is to do so when players remain to act between you and bring in but all have higher door cards than you.

Mandatory Raise: Even though you have a 9 or worse, you have two good cards and everybody else has a door card higher than any of yours. You know you have the best hand.

I think 5 is too extreme, but here's a milder version. If you catch 10 or higher while opponent catches 8 or lower that doesn't pair the board, check fold.

[jmbreslin]

I didn't intend (5) as an advanced strategy, more as a way to get a feel for the game before adding more advanced strategies. Kind of like starting with an incredibly tight, nitty approach in NLHE before adding more advanced stuff to your arsenal.