Playing a hand how it should be played...

[blah730235]

Over the last couple months my poker game has improved alot by reading up about holdem, playing alot of hands and reading people's thoughts on these forums. I keep examing my plays for leaks etc. so I can keep improving. I'm still having trouble however with what is probably my biggest leak - getting caught up in a hand and not playing how I know I should play the hand. Here's an example...

I've seen the main villian slowplay a good hand, call down with a pair, he hasn't suggested that he chases draws (i.e. call flop, call turn, fold river on a drawy board) he sees alot of flops and almost always limps preflop as well. I wrote down these notes on him after about ~ 40 hands

Hero is on the button with in 10$ NL 9 player holdem, stack sizes all ~ 10$
2 limpers 4 folds, hero limps, sb folds, bb checks
***Flop***
checked to hero, hero bets .35, bb calls, rest fold
(At this point I'm almost sure villian range is: Kx, 4x, small PP, theres a small possblity he has a hand like Q7, or a flush draw(unlikely). I'm praying he has the kings so i can stack him if the flush hits)

***Turn***
bb checks, hero bets 1$, bb calls

(I came up with this play after bb checked: I would make a pot sized bet on the turn extracting value out of his small pair/Q7 hand if he had that then I would shove the river and he would call if he had the kings and fold if he had the other. If he had a higher flush so be it but it seemed unlikely that he did. This way I would get value out of him with most of his range. If another diamond came down I would have to re-evalute but I figured the risk was worth it.)

***River***

bb shoves, Hero??

(Here the villian has come out of his passive mode, my notes on him line up, and I know he has Kx or 4x. I don't know why but I ended up calling him here and he flipped over that King.)


Enter Leak #1 - I got caught up in the hand and made a move I knew was wrong.
Enter Leak #2 - Now my next hand is dealt and i'm still running the hand over and over in my head, asking myself why I did not fold. Instead of playing a good poker game I start playing a so-so poker game or even worse I start playing a stupid poker game. Now the rest of my poker session and maybe even the next poker session - I don't play well and usually quit after I make enough stupid moves to realize I need to quit.


What really bugs me is this is only 10$ NL how bad is it going to hinder me if I play higher stakes? Anyways I was wondering if anyone had advice on the following?


- Relaxing during the middle of a big hand in order to make good sound desicions
- Letting mistakes go so you can countinue to play well


Note: I don't wish to discuss any part of the hand except the river, yes possibly I could have shoved the turn, bet more here or there, put him on a different range, but I am not concerned with what could have been a slightly better move. I am concerned with not makeing obvious bad mistakes like I did on the river.

[taz115]

I won't even offer advice ont he hand, since I don't play NL. But I can offer some advice on the rest.

Don't get worked up about mistakes, everyone makes them... even really stupid ones. I hate it when I make a big mistake and it costs me a tournament but there is no way to avoid that. Over time, if you put in the effort, you'll make less and less mistakes but when your starting out you'll make lots of big ones.

If something in hand throws you off, like a river card or a move from your opponent that you weren't expecting you just have to try and keep focused and take in the new information and figure out what your options are. Here you decision is call or fold but often you have many more options. Then you can evaluate what option is best based on what you know.

You'll likely get bettter at it as you gain more experience.

As for the tilting afterward, if you can't brush off a mistake and your playing a cash game you can always take a timeout or quit for the night. Some people never learn to avoid tilting after a bad beat or a mistake and some people deal with those situations quite well.

Piemaster and Matthew have written a great book that deals with lots of these types of questions. It's called the Poker Mindset and I'd recommend it to anyone new to the game or who is looking to shore up the mental aspect of their game.

taz115

[doubleup]

I agree with tazz. When it comes to the mental aspect, usually the only thing to help out is experience. The more hands you play, the more you'll get used to keeping relaxed and thinking throughout the entire hand properly.

I haven't read the poker mindset, but it is a book that definitely sounds interesting. When you know you're beat, that hardest thing to do is lay down a big hand such as a flush, or trips, AA, KK, etc. Once you learn to lay down big hands without getting upset about it, you'll overcome a huge obstacle that most poker players have problems doing.

[nsidestrate]

[Willem]

I think the fact that you are aware of the fact you made a mistake is very good, this puts you way ahead of your opponents. What remains is for you to look at this mistake multiple times and make sure you don't make the same mistake ever again.

As for me, I made a lot of horrendous mistakes in the past. But I learned from them and rarely make the same mistake twice. I still make many mistakes (no big ones anymore), but I always copy-paste the hand history and always look at these hands a few times to make sure I never make the same mistake again.

Someone who makes a mistake once is just learning, someone who makes the same mistake twice is an idiot.

[taz115]

[nsidestrate]

I find it self-corrects for me. When I make a mistake that I know I have made before, I am more resolved to correct that particular leak. Sometimes I have to make the same mistake many times. One problem is that "too much" and "not enough" of the same thing can be a leak, so it can be hard to find the right balance.

[Taardvark]

Leak #2 is the more serious leak if you are playing no limit games. Anytime you can release a second best hand and save money is always a good thing in no limit. Because of how much betting escalates continuing with a medium strength hand is problematic, and calling it on the river can be disasterous. It can eat away with you wondering "I wonder if he really had that king?", but at the end of the day it doesn't really matter. You are going to get bluffed sometimes and that's just part of the game.

Leak #1 will hopefully correct itself over time with practice and study. It appears you are on the right track already. As willem points out, you've identified and accepted you made a mistake on this hand and are looking for corrective action. Every good poker player does that constantly.

Nside brings up a solid point about another leak you need to look at. You have to go into every hand with a plan of action. That plan might change from street to street based on new information, such as the community cards, the betting action, and perhaps tells from your opponents, but you can't go into the hand blind. To truly evaluate a hand you need as much information as possible. Isolating a single decision in a hand can be useful, but taken out of context it might not give you the real information you are looking for.

Don't get discouraged. Every session provides opportunities for learning and self-evaluation. Overtime you will find fewer and fewer mistakes, and you should see improvements.

[Willem]

[jeffnc]

If you like poker books, then you can get this sort of information from The Poker Mindset, Elements of Poker, Tao of Poker, etc. Psychology books rather than strategy books.