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Player's Hands

 
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Zorro



Joined: 01 Sep 2006
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 10:38 am    Post subject: Player's Hands Reply with quote

Any advice or articles on the best approach on learning how to put opponents on a hand OR hand ranges ? I find this is one of my weak spots.
Thank you in advance.
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Taardvark
1K Club


Joined: 14 Feb 2007
Posts: 1054
Location: Fremont, CA

PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just about every decent poker book has a chapter or section about this. I am a big advocate of reading and applying but this is one area where I don't really think that the literature will help you much.

One of the best ways to practice is to really pay attention when you are not in the hand (live or online. It doesn't matter). You aren't going to be able to put someone on a hand for the most part unless you've seen them play for a little while. Learn what they raise with and when, learn what they call with and when, and learn what they limp with and when. How did they bet the last time when they had a set, a draw, TPTK, etc.? When do they check? When do they reraise or check raise? Live: Do they have any tells that can assist you? Online: Pay attention to betting patterns. Also online, make sure you check the hand history if someone calls a bet on the river and then mucks because you still get to see what they have. If you are using Pokertracker or other similar software online, make sure to go back and review hands that you misread and see if you can figure out where you made your mistake.

Most players, even the most patient, get bored when they aren't in the action. Use the hands you aren't in to test yourself and see how often you are dead on, really close, and completely wrong. Make sure to really think through the process as to why you thought what you did. This will keep you sharp throughout the whole session and obviously pays dividends.

This is really an area where practice makes perfect. The more you play and they more you study at the table the better you will get. I used to be have similar problems to you but over time you just get better at it. Also you have to accept that sometimes you are going to be wrong. Don't get discouraged by this. Even the best, like Negreanu who is super scary with his ability to put an opponent on a hand, sometimes make mistakes.
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emmapeel
2K Club


Joined: 05 Feb 2006
Posts: 2530
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 7:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know of any articles but this is one area that can be worked on on your own.

I sometimes think of it like a detective story with a lot of clues to try to make an answer from. I think it is important to get all the information you can first of all and then narrow it down to certain hands. Sometimes you can get the exact hand, sometimes you won't get anywhere at all.

I've always found it hard to watch other peoples hands and learn that way. I usually spend the most energy on this when I'm in a big pot for a lot of money and have to call a big bet; then it's....

1/ Is villain a tight or loose player?
2/ What did he do pre-flop; did he raise?
3/ What might he have looking at the flop and how he played that.

I think one of the best ways to develop this side of the game is to answer some of the hands in this forum. I think that has helped me more than any book has.

EP
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Scully



Joined: 25 Jul 2004
Posts: 634
Location: Manchester, UK

PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not going to claim to be an expert in this area - I'm probably more novice status so feel free to take this advice on board or not.

What I currently do is try and wrok out what hands I'm afraid of - e.g.: you have a set of 7s on a board of 2,3,4,6 (rainbow). You're only worried about the 5. I then go back over the play to date, and based on my opinion of the player, could he have the 5? Say villain is tight and open raised from middle position - would he do that with 55, A5s, A5 or any other 5? Very doubtful. If he's in the BB in an unraised pot that was checked round then there's every chance he does have the 5. Decisions are then based on bet size, your pot/implied odds of making a FH, etc. If it's a pot sized bet, has he done that before with a strong made hand, or does he usually put in a half pot sized bet in those circumstances.

By working out what I'm worried about its then a case of putting together the clues and deciding if the story villain is telling you adds up.
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gp00053



Joined: 01 Apr 2007
Posts: 70
Location: online

PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 10:17 am    Post subject: Re: Player's Hands Reply with quote

Zorro wrote:
Any advice or articles on the best approach on learning how to put opponents on a hand OR hand ranges ? I find this is one of my weak spots.
Thank you in advance.


Try this site http://www.pokerprofessor.co.uk

Go to Poker Strategy Module two, " Poker Starting Hands" There is a chart you can use that will gives a nice range of starting hands and positions to play them in for you to use. As far as putting opponents on a hand or hand ranges. Some players will tell you use the math. If you are getting the right pot odds to bet or call then that's what you do. Others will tell you classify players into groups'; example tight or losse, aggressive or passive. Then assign ranges to each of those groups. Others will tell you observe the players and put them on ranges based on past plays they have made. Some will tell you if you don't have a read then use the range that you would use yourself according to how you play.
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