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Cript
Cheesehead
Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5085
Location: Milwaukee, WI
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 Posted: Mon Sep 01, 2008 10:21 pm Post subject: No reads: Standard call down? |
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PokerStars Limit Hold'em, $2.00 BB (5 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
Preflop: Hero is UTG with  
Hero raises, 2 folds, SB 3-bets, 1 fold
Flop: (5 SB)    (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, SB raises, Hero 3-bets
Turn: (4.5 BB)  (2 players)
SB bets, Hero raises
River: (6.5 BB)  (2 players)
SB bets, Hero raises
Total pot: $17 (8.5 BB)
Everyone and their mom wait til the turn to c-r real hands now so I thought this was standard.
Wow, WTF converter, my raises are actually all calls cept pf. |
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Willem
2K Club
Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 2650
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 12:38 am Post subject: |
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| Looks standard. None of the draws comes in so you should have the best hand often enough here. You should still expect to lose this more often than not though, as he will have trips here sometimes, or 6x, or he accidentally spiked a pair. |
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wade
Should be Banned
Joined: 11 Oct 2004
Posts: 3055
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| Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 3:36 pm Post subject: Re: No reads: Standard call down? |
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| Cript wrote: | | Everyone and their mom wait til the turn to c-r real hands now so I thought this was standard. |
I often check raise the flop HU with weakish made hands, but usually not with air. Is this guy a maniac?
| Quote: | | You should still expect to lose this more often than not though, as he will have trips here sometimes, or 6x, or he accidentally spiked a pair. |
Or he started with an overpair, underpair, or bigger ace  Without any reads I may have given up on the turn.
This is a boaderline UTG raise for me 5 or 6 handed againt unknowns - not that I don't do it here and there, but it's usually a huge loser for me at showdown in hands that play out like this. I wouldn't expect to win this hand very often against an unknown on this river (or flop, or turn). |
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Willem
2K Club
Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 2650
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 1:49 am Post subject: Re: No reads: Standard call down? |
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| wade wrote: | | This is a boaderline UTG raise for me 5 or 6 handed againt unknowns - not that I don't do it here and there, but it's usually a huge loser for me at showdown in hands that play out like this. I wouldn't expect to win this hand very often against an unknown on this river (or flop, or turn). |
It obviously depends on your style but this is an easy raise for me. I will even raise A2s here if the table conditions are right. |
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Cript
Cheesehead
Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5085
Location: Milwaukee, WI
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 9:49 am Post subject: Re: No reads: Standard call down? |
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| Willem wrote: | | wade wrote: | | This is a boaderline UTG raise for me 5 or 6 handed againt unknowns - not that I don't do it here and there, but it's usually a huge loser for me at showdown in hands that play out like this. I wouldn't expect to win this hand very often against an unknown on this river (or flop, or turn). |
It obviously depends on your style but this is an easy raise for me. I will even raise A2s here if the table conditions are right. |
Ditto...A9s is way ahead of my necessary range. Especially at 1/2 where QJ is worth a cold call. |
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Willem
2K Club
Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 2650
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 10:54 am Post subject: Re: No reads: Standard call down? |
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| Cript wrote: | | Especially at 1/2 where QJ is worth a cold call. |
I assume you mean QJs here? And I also assume you mean cold-calling after a raiser and another cold-caller? |
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Cript
Cheesehead
Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5085
Location: Milwaukee, WI
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 12:52 pm Post subject: Re: No reads: Standard call down? |
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| Willem wrote: | | Cript wrote: | | Especially at 1/2 where QJ is worth a cold call. |
I assume you mean QJs here? And I also assume you mean cold-calling after a raiser and another cold-caller? |
I'm not the one cold calling 
I was referring to my being able to raise A9s for value since QJo will cold call me. |
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Willem
2K Club
Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 2650
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 1:32 pm Post subject: Re: No reads: Standard call down? |
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| Cript wrote: | | Willem wrote: | | Cript wrote: | | Especially at 1/2 where QJ is worth a cold call. |
I assume you mean QJs here? And I also assume you mean cold-calling after a raiser and another cold-caller? |
I'm not the one cold calling
I was referring to my being able to raise A9s for value since QJo will cold call me. |
Ok, just checking. The mere thought of cold calling QJo send shivers down my spine.
Then again, I just found out I'm a losing player after all:
http://www.pokerlistings.com/market-pulse/online-player-search-result?handle=willem_d
So take my advice with a grain of salt. |
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Cript
Cheesehead
Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5085
Location: Milwaukee, WI
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 1:44 pm Post subject: Re: No reads: Standard call down? |
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| Willem wrote: | | Cript wrote: | | Willem wrote: | | Cript wrote: | | Especially at 1/2 where QJ is worth a cold call. |
I assume you mean QJs here? And I also assume you mean cold-calling after a raiser and another cold-caller? |
I'm not the one cold calling
I was referring to my being able to raise A9s for value since QJo will cold call me. |
Ok, just checking. The mere thought of cold calling QJo send shivers down my spine.
Then again, I just found out I'm a losing player after all:
http://www.pokerlistings.com/market-pulse/online-player-search-result?handle=willem_d
So take my advice with a grain of salt. |
Lol, according to your blog, i think I'll heed what you say.
Looks like I'm kicking ass though.
http://www.pokerlistings.com/market-pulse/online-player-search-result?handle=cript29 |
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Willem
2K Club
Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 2650
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 1:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Actually, pretty much all the big winners in LHE (like Hoss, KPR) are all classified as a "redfish" (like me). I think it's safe to assume the tool draws the wrong conclusions. The tool probably looks at the postflop aggression factor. When it's below 2, it automatically assumes the player is too passive. |
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Cript
Cheesehead
Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5085
Location: Milwaukee, WI
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| Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 1:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Willem wrote: | | Actually, pretty much all the big winners in LHE (like Hoss, KPR) are all classified as a "redfish" (like me). I think it's safe to assume the tool draws the wrong conclusions. The tool probably looks at the postflop aggression factor. When it's below 2, it automatically assumes the player is too passive. |
I appear to be a redfish when isolating my search to FL SH. I would recommend immediately publicizing this product as a way to find fish. |
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