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Willem
2K Club
Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 2652
Location: Netherlands
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 Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 3:12 pm Post subject: Ignoring short term results. |
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Lately, I've been experimenting with not looking at any short term results. Ask yourself this question: How relevant are your short term results? TPM say that short term results are mainly determined by luck. If they are determined mainly by luck, why even bother looking at them. What good will it do you, besides ruining your mood if you are losing?
The idea is like this: I start up a number of tables and put (improvised) tilt blockers on both stacks. Now, during the session, I don't see whether I'm up or down, allowing me to focus on the only thing that matters, which is making the correct decisions. Then after the session, I don't even look at how I did. Nor do I look when I quit playing for the day.
Advantages:
- I don't tilt if I lose a lot since I am simply not aware of the fact. I probably know I am losing but I don't know how much.
- In a session, I spend no time whatsoever on looking at how much I'm up or down. I find that I spend significantly less energy per session played, which means I can play a lot more hands per day before growing tired.
- My mood isn't affected by how I run, which is good if you are run bad.
Disadvantages:
- You need a big roll (800BB+) to avoid going broke because you don't step down.
- You need to be very confident in you ability to beat the games you play in. This makes it perhaps difficult to do for beginning players.
I did this a few weeks and I really like it. Simply not knowing your short term results makes playing less stressful. I'm actually thinking about just playing for now and only look at how I did at the end of this month.
Anyone else do this? |
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the_hawk
Chelsea FTW!
Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 4346
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| Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 6:40 pm Post subject: |
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Sounds like a good idea, can't imagine ever doing it myself though. From what I know of you through this forum I'd suggest you're probably just about the last person who needs to do this.  |
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Piemaster
Author of THE POKER MINDSET
Joined: 15 Jan 2004
Posts: 6932
Location: London
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| Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 3:47 am Post subject: |
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| I like it, providing you have the bankroll, the confidence and the discipline to stick to it. Maybe I would start with a week rather than a month, to see how it goes. |
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Willem
2K Club
Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 2652
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:54 am Post subject: |
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| Piemaster wrote: | | I like it, providing you have the bankroll, the confidence and the discipline to stick to it. Maybe I would start with a week rather than a month, to see how it goes. |
I already did it two times for a week and I really liked it. After a few days, you really don't have any idea how you are running. I find that I enjoying playing a lot more this way. And since I don't spend any energy/time dealing with the short term swings, I can spend these on more productive things. And after playing like this for a few day, I can honestly say I don't even want to know. I mean, what good will it do me knowing about my luck. It's not like I can control it or anything.
If you really want to play for the long run and can resist the temptation to look at your results, I think this approach is perfect. (At least, it is for me) |
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Misunderstud
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Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1666
Location: Here, stupid
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| Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 6:43 am Post subject: Re: Ignoring short term results. |
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| Willem wrote: | | Ask yourself this question: How relevant are your short term results? TPM say that short term results are mainly determined by luck. If they are determined mainly by luck, why even bother looking at them. What good will it do you, besides ruining your mood if you are losing? |
Well, exactly. As Hawk implies, I'd have thought you were one of the least results-oriented people here, so I'm a bit surprised that your play might be affected by them.
But anything that improves your play, psychological or otherwise, can only be good. What ruin my mood are poor decisions. I don't really worry about whether I've won or lost a session per se, though if I'm losing and catch myself making stupid plays I generally just stop playing. But I do like the warm fuzzy feeling you get when you have a +50BB day. 
Actually, I find that longer-term results can be more depressing. (What, you've played that many hands and won only that much?) I usually reset my stats at the beginning of every month. Each month is a new month and, indeed, each day is a new day.
So long as you're confident you're playing well enough to beat the game, both short- and medium-term results are largely irrelevant, and the long term should take care of itself.
Each to his own, though, and I can see how this might be liberating.
What is a tilt blocker? |
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Llanlad
Whinge-Free
Joined: 20 Dec 2004
Posts: 3490
Location: Educating LFC fans
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| Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2008 3:02 am Post subject: |
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I think this is a great idea ... but alas .. there is no chance i could do it 
I have a terrible habit of having my session showing on PT and i force an inport every couple of minutes .. 
I have to try and stop this ... as you say ... its actually mentally draining and probably a big reason why i cant play for more than 90 mins at a time ..
I update my spreadsheets after every session ... so this might not work for me ... but i could maybe update the spreadsheets at the end of every day instead of every session i suppose ..
The problem with this is .... I would get the inpulse to check how i was doing well before the end of the day ...
Nevertheless ... very interesting idea .. I could do it for a day i suppose ... and maybe stretch it to 2 days ... then 3 .. and so on ... |
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the_hawk
Chelsea FTW!
Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 4346
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| Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2008 7:10 am Post subject: |
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| Mis wrote: | | What is a tilt blocker? |
A strategically placed sliver of post-it, covering up the stack size at the table, does the job.
| Llan wrote: | | Nevertheless ... very interesting idea .. I could do it for a day i suppose ... and maybe stretch it to 2 days ... then 3 .. and so on ... |
Ya, right. |
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Willem
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Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 2652
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2008 8:05 am Post subject: |
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| the_hawk wrote: | | Mis wrote: | | What is a tilt blocker? |
A strategically placed sliver of post-it, covering up the stack size at the table, does the job. |
Yes, although is't not a real post-it. I have very small program which forces an application to stay on top (like the wondows taskbar). I then make notepad as small as possible, make it stay on top and put is over my stack.
| Llanlad wrote: | | I have to try and stop this ... as you say ... its actually mentally draining and probably a big reason why i cant play for more than 90 mins at a time |
This is actually the biggest advantage for me. It's not like I tilt when I'm losing (although there are some subtle changes in my game). I simply think energy spend on looking at results (and the emotional roller coaster) is wasted energy.
I imagine things would work a little differently in your case since you play NL. I don't think a lilt blocker is usable since the size of your stack is actually strategically important. But the thing that matters is that you somehow lose track of how you are running. I think you can simply re-buy to 100BB every time you are on the button. Once you did that a few times, you will also have no exact idea how much you are up or down. (if you resist the temptation to look at PT every few minutes) |
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Llanlad
Whinge-Free
Joined: 20 Dec 2004
Posts: 3490
Location: Educating LFC fans
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| Posted: Sat Mar 08, 2008 10:11 am Post subject: |
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| the_hawk wrote: | | Ya, right. Wink |
hehehe .. brilliant .... and to be honest .. i know where your coming from 
Have to say ... not had the chance to play much since posting last time ... but this thread has really got me thinking ..
I knew i had a problem with my emotions when i play ... mainly because im soooooo short term results orientated ... which is terrible for poker ..
Im not going to say i can last a week without having a look at my stats .. but i will be able to play upto 3 sessions in a day and only look at the stats at the end of the day ..
Im amazed ive not realised this earlier ... I can really let my emotions get the better of me in a session when i know ive gone 800 hands without hitting a damn thing .. im actually looking at the PT Misc stats and seeing ive not hit one flush or straight all day ..
This happens if ive played 100 hands or 800 hands .. makes no real difference ..
Not sure about the tilt blocker though ... maybe thats more suited to limit and not NL ..
Thanks Willem ... im well happy about trying this ....... even if hawk has no faith in me |
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Misunderstud
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Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1666
Location: Here, stupid
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 9:08 am Post subject: |
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| the_hawk wrote: | | Mis wrote: | | What is a tilt blocker? |
A strategically placed sliver of post-it, covering up the stack size at the table, does the job. |
ROFL. Let me just check my calendar - nope, it's not 1 April. So not only does this actually happen - there's even a name for it. I guess you have to tell visitors that your monitor cut itself shaving.
Sorry, I'll go away and be serious now. |
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Willem
2K Club
Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 2652
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 10:25 am Post subject: |
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| Llanlad wrote: | | Im not going to say i can last a week without having a look at my stats .. but i will be able to play upto 3 sessions in a day and only look at the stats at the end of the day .. |
Even this will be a big improvement over looking at your PT stats every 5 minutes. It's true that you will still know whether you are running good or bad, but not knowing exactly how much is already an improvement IMO. |
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