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Hand from October league match

 
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Corbijn



Joined: 08 Nov 2005
Posts: 226
Location: denmark

PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 2:43 pm    Post subject: Hand from October league match Reply with quote

This hand came up early in last nights ITH league match. (27 players)
Cript asked me to post it and get some reactions on the play here.

He had been very active during the first couple of hands . Playing small ball with Toro two to my left.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $5.00+$0.50 Tournament, 10/20 Blinds (6 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

cript29 (UTG) (t1500)
MP (t1480)
CO (t1510)
Corbijn (Button) (t1470)
SB (t1510)
BB (t1530)

Preflop: Corbijn is Button with Queen of Clubs, Queen of Diamonds
cript29 raises to t60, 2 folds, Corbijn calls t60, 2 folds

Flop: (t150) 9 of Clubs, Jack of Clubs, 2 of Hearts (2 players)
cript29 bets t60, Corbijn raises to t160, cript29 raises to t320, Corbijn calls t160

Turn: (t790) Ace of Diamonds (2 players)
cript29 bets t400, Corbijn folds

Total pot: t790
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Cript
Cheesehead


Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5112
Location: Milwaukee, WI

PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Corbijn,

I'm very interested to see what everyone thinks the proper post-flop line should be here. You almost certainly have to let go on the turn but I am trying to decide on the best flop line.

BTW: Congrats on the finish!
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Corbijn



Joined: 08 Nov 2005
Posts: 226
Location: denmark

PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanx.
I dont know whether to try post it in the multi tourney categori or not.
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ImBetterDude



Joined: 18 Jul 2007
Posts: 747
Location: California

PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm reraising healthily when Cript min-raises...essentially pot committing myself on the flop. Barring some kind of extraordinary read I'm assuming my QQ is good on this flop 98% of the time.

Plus...people play in these more for the commraderie (sp) than for money, right? He was probably just trying to out play you. Maybe not though, who knows. By just calling you ended up seeing a pretty bad card on the turn, and to make matters worse his betting line hasn't changed.

I fold the turn as played, but reraise the flop.
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Raisindye



Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 353
Location: Maryland

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 12:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i'm a double postin fool

Last edited by Raisindye on Tue Oct 07, 2008 12:07 am; edited 1 time in total
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Raisindye



Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 353
Location: Maryland

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

first off, congrats on your win sir...

now, this may sound rude, but i am going to have to start on the pf play. why would you ever not re-raise pf when you are otb facing a raise? i'm a big fan of becoming the primary aggressor with my (more than likely) best hands. there are times for being coy, but very early in a tourney imo are not among them.

after that, what kind of flop do you need to see, to make you not allow your opponent to get away with a min-raise after you have bet?

i'll quit there and promise that i don't mean to sound like a total jerk. i've been drinking, and that's my disclaimer... although, i really feel like this hand was mucked up from the jump

P
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cowboyinexile



Joined: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 378
Location: South Dakota

PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Hand from October league match Reply with quote

UTG raise against someone who knows what they are doing-you gotta re-raise here. Its early and you can put him to the test without pot committing yourself. Yeah, if he represents rockets, you hurt your stack, but its early and is something that is recoverable.

The flop is the discussion. So you play queens passively preflop, the flop is both good and bad for you. All unders and he cbets-now you decide to put him to the test. Your raise was a bit weak-if he is sitting on Ace of Clubs King of Clubs, you are giving him great odds to call and with the range of hands he can have, you are giving him a chance to put you off the hand here. You should have raised this hand the pot-the way you played it, he has a range high enough that it could be a c-bet bluff and you can represent an over play of AJ here or more likely a set protecting against a flush draw. If you make a strong bet, he probably doesn't have you on Queens, but he may likely have you on jacks. If he has the flush draw, he's likely to call here and outdraw you. If he has an over, either he's gonna tell you queens are no good here or he's gonna sit back and let it go unless the turn card helps him.
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Corbijn



Joined: 08 Nov 2005
Posts: 226
Location: denmark

PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raisindye Im not one to get mad when i get critigued.
The truth is I cant tell you why i didnt reraise. I will do that 99% of the time, I think it might be that cript had been playing smallball poker and i didnt want him to let it go PF.
On another note I was very tired and not in the mood for playing, but couldnt let the leaguematch go by.

With cripts flop play I believe I could very well be in front, but didnt think i could get a hand like Ace of Clubs King of Clubs to fold and I didnt want to risk all the chips so early. 6 or 7 hands into the tourney.
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Cript
Cheesehead


Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5112
Location: Milwaukee, WI

PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had Ace of Clubs 3 of Clubs here. IMO, I played the flop like I had a set when 3-betting. I'm just not certain that hero can get allin with QQ on a flop like this. The blinds are still tiny, it's a tough tourney field, and we only have 1 pair.
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toronexti
53o


Joined: 03 Sep 2004
Posts: 4240

PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I think it might be that cript had been playing smallball poker and i didnt want him to let it go PF.


Actually, you misread cript. He wasn't playing small-ball at that point (or actually at any point IIRC). He was mainly just trying to pick on me, so I was playing small-ball vs him and he wasn't sure how to adjust. But I'm pretty sure he was looking to get into a bunch of big pots - not into a bunch of small pots.

He can correct me if I'm wrong.
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Cript
Cheesehead


Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5112
Location: Milwaukee, WI

PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

toronexti wrote:
Quote:
I think it might be that cript had been playing smallball poker and i didnt want him to let it go PF.


Actually, you misread cript. He wasn't playing small-ball at that point (or actually at any point IIRC). He was mainly just trying to pick on me, so I was playing small-ball vs him and he wasn't sure how to adjust. But I'm pretty sure he was looking to get into a bunch of big pots - not into a bunch of small pots.

He can correct me if I'm wrong.


You were indeed wrong. I didn't check-raise you once when I thought I had a big hand, I also played extremely passively vs you. I was trying my best to control pot size, something I don't usually have to do in 180s where top pair is always good.
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cowboyinexile



Joined: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 378
Location: South Dakota

PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cript wrote:
I had Ace of Clubs 3 of Clubs here. IMO, I played the flop like I had a set when 3-betting. I'm just not certain that hero can get allin with QQ on a flop like this. The blinds are still tiny, it's a tough tourney field, and we only have 1 pair.


I gotta ask. What do you do if he shoves on the turn? His hand doesn't read like a bigger Ace, but on the turn you caught a "thanks" card.
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