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Cript
Cheesehead
Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5072
Location: Milwaukee, WI
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 Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 8:02 pm Post subject: First Vent in Forever: Why I can't win big tourneys |
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This is the 30k, would be 5k to first, if I could somehow dodge this crap for one whole tourney. I don't want to get lucky at cards, I just don't want them to either.
Poker Stars
No Limit Holdem Tournament
Blinds: t150/t300
(Ante: t25)
9 players
Converter
Stack sizes:
UTG: t12650
UTG+1: t14638
MP1: t12700
MP2: t6086
MP3: t9951
CO: t12244
Cript: t9605
SB: t26865
BB: t4415
Pre-flop: (9 players) Cript is Button with  
UTG folds, UTG+1 raises to t900, 4 folds, Cript calls t900 (pot was t1575), 2 folds.
Flop:    (t2475, 2 players)
UTG+1 checks, Cript bets t1500, UTG+1 raises all-in t13713, Cript calls all-in t7180.
Uncalled bets: t5033 returned to UTG+1.
This wasn't an easy call, but I certainly felt like I was ahead.
Turn:  (t19835, 0 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: t19835)
River:  (t19835, 0 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: t19835)
Results:
Final pot: t19835
UTG+1 showed Js Ah
My chance to win: 84 %
My chance to tie: 4%
MOTHER f*** STANDARD |
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Cript
Cheesehead
Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5072
Location: Milwaukee, WI
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| Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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| naturally the guy who beat me has like 200k in winnings on thepokerdb, f*** variance |
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ImBetterDude
Joined: 18 Jul 2007
Posts: 657
Location: California
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 1:59 am Post subject: |
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| I feel your pain. |
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Raisindye
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 306
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 10:38 am Post subject: |
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You split the pot, didn't lose the pot, and were well alive with over 9k left @ the 150/300 blind level... right? Am I missing something? What happened the rest of the tourney?
I mean, tough break on the split Cript, but for this to be your first rave in a long time one would expect you got blown out of the water with some sorta 5 outs or less hand! |
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Cript
Cheesehead
Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5072
Location: Milwaukee, WI
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 10:50 am Post subject: |
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| Raisindye wrote: | You split the pot, didn't lose the pot, and were well alive with over 9k left @ the 150/300 blind level... right? Am I missing something? What happened the rest of the tourney?
I mean, tough break on the split Cript, but for this to be your first rave in a long time one would expect you got blown out of the water with some sorta 5 outs or less hand! |
Rest of tourney was 44 < AT near the bubble.
You aren't getting it. I split the pot that would've made me a top 1% chipstack. You have to win hands like this to win a tourney, it's that easy.
I'd rather push AA pre flop and have a guy call off on 22 to beat me than something like this, where I make a perfect read on a great player only to have him donk out a split. |
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Raisindye
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 306
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Cript wrote: |
You aren't getting it. I split the pot that would've made me a top 1% chipstack. You have to win hands like this to win a tourney, it's that easy.
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I can assure you sir, I get it. I've played a few tourneys here and there.
And unfortunately for you, I think you are missing THE point. These things are standard tourney happenings. It happens, and sometimes it ends your tourney and you don't get a chance to do shit else. Boom.... it's over, and you are in the bottom 1%... not the top. So, it doesn't matter what this hand did to you at that very moment in the tourney, you had plenty of life left to play the game and that hand had NO bearing on your tourney outcome. You can't prove to me for one second that if you got to the top 1% in stacks there, that you would even make the money in that tourney. That, unfortunately, is exactly how it works. Just think about it next time, and good luck in the future. |
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Raisindye
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 306
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Cript wrote: |
Rest of tourney was 44 < AT near the bubble.
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Now, THIS is the kind of hands you must win to win tourneys. Races, near the bubble, when blinds are huge!
Also, as for the OP... repop with AK in position on the original raiser. Take over as the aggressor and you might get a different outcome. Not sure, but it may happen.
P |
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Cript
Cheesehead
Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5072
Location: Milwaukee, WI
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Raisindye wrote: | | Cript wrote: |
Rest of tourney was 44 < AT near the bubble.
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Now, THIS is the kind of hands you must win to win tourneys. Races, near the bubble, when blinds are huge!
Also, as for the OP... repop with AK in position on the original raiser. Take over as the aggressor and you might get a different outcome. Not sure, but it may happen.
P |
Why do I want to repop...I got my money in as an 8 to 1 favorite...you're telling me that has no bearing on the outcome of a tourney? 8 to 1 to win a 20k pot?
That gives me chips to resteal all I want...having 9k at 150/300 means a resteal is 1/3 of my stack. |
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Raisindye
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 306
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Cript wrote: |
Why do I want to repop...I got my money in as an 8 to 1 favorite...you're telling me that has no bearing on the outcome of a tourney? 8 to 1 to win a 20k pot?
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Now you are thinking results based poker, and not thinking about the big picture. I was talking big picture, and not just that particular hand. I will repop with AK there 99.99% of the times.
| Cript wrote: |
That gives me chips to resteal all I want...having 9k at 150/300 means a resteal is 1/3 of my stack.
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I'm not really sure what to say to this. I tried to tell you that tournaments are long events that take all kinds of turns. I don't wanna get in a pissing contest over this. I'll just end any assistance I was trying to provide and say, GL sir. |
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janeg
Regina Canada
Joined: 04 Oct 2004
Posts: 5104
Location: Somewhere down the crazy river
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| Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 10:37 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I don't want to get lucky at cards, I just don't want them to either. |
lol...Cript, no one getting lucky is the same as everyone having the same amount of luck ie variance. What you're hoping for is no variance, and that ain't gonna happen.
As to splitting the pot, you've played enough to know that's gonna happen; if this was a limit game you wouldn't think twice about it; it's only sticking in your craw because it happened in an MTT where you were hoping to stack someone.
I think Raisin has it right, re-pop 'em here PF. What are the chances he would check/raise you all-in if you had made it 2,700 PF? Yeah, he might fold, but picking up 1575t with AK ain't all that bad and if he pushes, you're happy to call. |
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chrisjp
Mr. Lovable
Joined: 03 Jun 2004
Posts: 4994
Location: Round Rock, TX and Las Vegas
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| Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 11:48 am Post subject: |
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I'm not reraising preflop, maybe one of the blinds will try a squeeze and I could get heads up with dead money in there and be a nice favorite, or at worst likely only a small dog. Small ball, that's me in position usually.
But to the point of the rant....it's just part of the game. You made a nice call. You split which happens once in 25 times. That's more likely than hitting a number on the roulette wheel.
This is about decision making. You played great. You won lots of Sklansky Dollars. Well not a huge number because it was still fairly early. But you earned as many as you could.
As Howard Lederer repeatedly stresses you need to play in the moment. That hand is completely irrelevant to the rest of this tournament. Just concentrate on the future. You can review hands later to examine them for mistakes or insightful moves, but not now. Just stay in the moment.
Short term results don't really matter......they really don't. If you are good then everything will take care of itself. By good I'm not just talking about your technical play but the whole package. BR management, game selection, study, working on eliminating tilt, the works.
I've always thought that gambling was one of the most just activities in the world. You do have to worry about getting cheated, but you don't have to worry about corporate politics or about getting figuratively stabbed in the back by your partner. You get what you deserve...whatever that is. Suffering a bad beat doesn't bother me in the slightest; making a bad play drives me nuts. Hopefully for not too long though. I remember in the 2006 ITH tournament for a Seat to the Main Event. We were down to three: me, toro and nardo. And everything fell apart and I finished third. Now that didn't bother me. What drove me bonkers was that I knew I had played poorly, and didn't really know how I should have played. So I went to therapy. I discussed the hands with Seadood, Elmo, Ciaran, and chillin. They helped a lot, I figured out the problem, and moved up the poker ladder. toro didn't give me any of his winnings, but he helped with analysis too. That experience helped me tremendously.
Now in the Seniors tournament at the WSOP I was JJvAQ with 12 remaining and that was monstrous $$$ flip. And I was almost 57% to win it. And I lost. Well I've certainly thought about what might have been, but I haven't dwelled on it and it hasn't affected my future play. I'm just happy that I played the hand correctly, or think I did..
Time for cript to read the Poker Mindset again methinks. 
Chris |
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Cript
Cheesehead
Joined: 13 Feb 2004
Posts: 5072
Location: Milwaukee, WI
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| Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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| chrisjp wrote: |
Time for cript to read the Poker Mindset again methinks.
Chris |
Admittedly haven't done so the first time yet |
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