Caught in the middle with you, T9s 10/20 limit 6-max

[Rubeskies]

BB is unknown
Button is a LAG

PokerMind $10/$20 Limit Hold 'em
6max table, 6 handed
Hand created by PokerMind SuperConverter
View Hand in PokerMind

PREFLOP: Hero is CO with
2 folds, Hero raises to $20, Button raises to $30, SB folds, BB calls $20, Hero calls $10

FLOP: (3 players, 19 SB/$95 total pot)
BB bets $10

Lots of options here.

[Piemaster]

Against an unknown I would raise here and force the button to put up or shut up. What do do next would depend on the subsequent action.

I don't like either folding or calling at this point.

[Schlepper333]

*Grunch

Raising with T9s from EP is a little rich for my blood but prolly a matter of style and how well you can play the flop. On the flop we have no over cards and only a backdoor draw to go with our second pair. I call here and see what the turn brings.

BTW Welcome to the forum.

[Rubeskies]

[Cript]

I'm folding here...BB betting into a 3-bettor and I've got 2nd pair, 3 to a straight and no flush draw...

[ciaran]

I don't play limit much, and not at $10/$20 anyway, but I think I'm with Pie. We should have pretty decent equity vs a LAG button, and if we can fold him our equity vs even a pretty tight range for BB goes up quite a bit.

OTOH, I don't know how easy this is to play even after we fold BTN out. Do we just call down if he keeps betting?

[shallam]

I like folding here.


While thinking about the hand I kept coming back to the nagging question, "why is the BB betting ?"


The BB doesn't need to be involved in this hand. He could have folded pre-flop or check folded on the flop. He's betting into two opps, both of whom have shown strength before the flop. Certainly not a standard bluffing opporunity. It seems VERY unlikely that he's on a stone cold bluff. How much worse of a hand could he have ? 88 maybe ?

If I had a huge hand I might very well bet out hoping to get raised and possibly catching two opps for 3 bets each on the flop. That will earn me more money then check raising on the turn, even if he calls the check raise (which he might not). People often posture on the flop, I good time to catch them for an extra bet or two that you won't be able to squeeze out later. OTOH, maybe at your level your opp has thought all this thru and is outsmarting my thinking by going to next level (ok now I have headache just thinking about it).

An optimist might point that you are getting 9.5-1 on your call, you might have the best hand, and you might have five outs even if you are currently beat. However, given the strength shown by the BB I doubt you have the best hand, there is a possibility of raise behind you (or re-reraise if you choose to raise), and your five outs need to be discounted somewhat anyway. If you discount down to 4 outs you aren't getting the necessary 11-1 odds unless you are very generous with implied odds. If you had a little something extra here like a gutshot, bdfd, it might turn a marginal fold into a marginal raise/call.

[Bugsbunny]

[Bugsbunny]

The pot is already large. The flop hit you, and it's short handed. If you raise here and get the BT to fold you are now in a HU (large) pot, with position.

On the other hand if BT calls 2 cold here I'd start getting a bit worried. If BT raises and BB caps then at that point I'm gone. If it comes back to me 1 more I have to call and see what happens.

BB can be betting here with a potentially wide range (I know I would be), If he can eliminate even 1 player the chances of his winning the hand go up drastically, no matter what he has. I'd probably be betting out here with any pair and definitely with any draw (including gutshots).

The eliminate 1 player goes for you as well. And if BB is the kind that almost always defends his blind then raising his bet is even more important.

If the players are knowns then everything changes, of course, depending on what you know.

[jeffnc]

Normally raise the flop here. Folding isn't horrible, but if you're going to fold this flop as your standard play late position in a 6 handed $10/20 game, you probably don't belong in a 6 handed $10/20 game. If you want to be cautious a better way to go about it is: raise the flop, fold the next player, BB calls, he checks to you on the turn, you check, he bets the river, you call no matter what cards come. If you can't fold the button, then you can consider not putting any more money in. If the button folds but the BB reraises (you have to call then of course) or just calls but in either case bets the turn, you have to decide what sort of player he is and either be a showdown monkey or bail.