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Can you fold 777 here?????

 
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PigPen



Joined: 06 Nov 2005
Posts: 850

PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 7:00 pm    Post subject: Can you fold 777 here????? Reply with quote

Bodog 10/25 FR
Saw Villain play 3 pots in 5 orbits. He's a solid player. He folded on flop in 2, won the third w/o showdown. I had played 3 pots as well though none against him, I folded all three - 2 to bets on the flop when I missed, and 1 when my CB was met with an OTT. Then I hit this set on the turn, I couldn't tell what he had but I got a sick feeling when he put me AI on the river. He doesn't have 9T that I'm sure. I figured most likely 88, AK, AQ, or AJ. But KK and AA are possible too. Do you call here with that sick feeling and hope you don't get stacked or fold it?

SB (?)
BB (?)
UTG (?)
UTG+1 (-)
MP1 (-)
Villain MP2 (89.00)
Hero MP3 (15.00)
CO (?)
Button (?)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with 7 of Clubs 7 of Hearts
1 fold, 2 call, Villain raises .90, Hero calls 90, 2 folds, BB SB fold, 2 call pot = $4.45

Flop: Ace of Diamonds 3 of Clubs 8 of Hearts (4 players)
checks to me, Hero checks

Turn: 7 of Spades (4 players)
checks to villain, Villain bets $1.60 Hero raises $3.40, 2 fold, Villain calls

River: 6 of Hearts(2 players)
Villain bets $20.00, Hero wtf???
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Shake_N_Bake



Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 132
Location: Cheyenne, WY

PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What do you think the possibility of villain having a weak suited A such is A8, A6 or A3 would be? I am thinking about that and the possibility of 66. From the hands listed above you may be giving him to much credit.
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Damo_1
PauliF Fan Club


Joined: 04 Aug 2005
Posts: 1036
Location: Playing sets fast

PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd shove the turn, or at least raise much bigger to commit me to the pot regardless of the river card. As played snap call the river as lower sets, two pairs, an overplayed AK and complete bluffs are all in his range. Sure, he may have T9 or a slowplayed set with AA/88 but you only have about a pot sized bet left in your stack and have to call off ~$10 so it's a no-brainer imo.
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dankimball



Joined: 14 Mar 2007
Posts: 282
Location: arkansas

PostPosted: Tue Sep 16, 2008 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

awwwww innnnnnnnn...easy shove
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emmapeel
2K Club


Joined: 05 Feb 2006
Posts: 2530
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 4:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hero has $11 or the size of the pot on the river so villains bet is just a pot sized bet. It seems to represent T9 as that hand makes sense with the betting pattern. I suppose a set is possible too and villain slow-played that till the river.

I'm certainly not folding a set here as villain could have a bluff in his range as opposed to a big hand. There are no possible flushes and only one likely straight. Not everyone would raise T9 pre-flop either so there are doubts about the straight.

AA or 88? I think these are possible although the betting looks a bit odd. I think losing to a higher set on this board is just bad luck especially with only a 60BB stack.

For me this is an easy call. I think we are well ahead here despite the pot-odds. Villain can have so many weaker hands and there are so few better ones.

EP
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emmapeel
2K Club


Joined: 05 Feb 2006
Posts: 2530
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 4:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Card combinations can help here. It is good to know how likely a hand is here.

A set has 3 combinations so AA and 88 both have 3 each. T9suited has 4 so in total we are afraid of about 10 different hands.

AK has 12 combinations and so if you think villain is as likely to have played this hand this way as the others then this is already a very easy call as we are ahead. AK looks unlikely to me but there are so many other hands that are more likely that we beat.

EP
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blah730235



Joined: 02 May 2008
Posts: 162

PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Saw Villain play 3 pots in 5 orbits. He's a solid player. He folded on flop in 2


This guy doesn't sound like a solid player to me, he's got a VP$IP of ~ 7% over the last ~ 45 hands. Although he could very well be a good player (since we only have about 45 hands to go by) but we should put the label of 'nit' on him until future hands prove otherwise.
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PigPen



Joined: 06 Nov 2005
Posts: 850

PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 5:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

blah730235 wrote:
Quote:
Saw Villain play 3 pots in 5 orbits. He's a solid player. He folded on flop in 2


This guy doesn't sound like a solid player to me, he's got a VP$IP of ~ 7% over the last ~ 45 hands. Although he could very well be a good player (since we only have about 45 hands to go by) but we should put the label of 'nit' on him until future hands prove otherwise.
Compared to the other flop hounds I know he's not playing junk.

Anyway, I knew I was beat so I couldn't call, but I couldn't fold a set here either. So, with a sick feeling, I called and got stacked. He flopped a set of Aces. Too many plays like this has me questioning some of my plays. But since misery loves company, I'm glad to see we all lost. Confused
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PigPen



Joined: 06 Nov 2005
Posts: 850

PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shake_N_Bake wrote:
What do you think the possibility of villain having a weak suited A such is A8, A6 or A3 would be? I am thinking about that and the possibility of 66. From the hands listed above you may be giving him to much credit.
Slim to none, he's too tight to play A9s- in EP or MP.
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blah730235



Joined: 02 May 2008
Posts: 162

PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2008 3:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't really understand his reasoning for calling the turn and donking the river. He gives the 9 of Spades 10 of Spades part of your range a chance to suck out on him (and I see hero playing 9 of Spades 10 of Spades this way at least sometimes) while still extracting the same amount of value from hands that would have paid him off if he had pushed the turn.
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